D&D (2024) Its The Same Game Right? 5.0 Options in 5.5

DEFCON 1 said:
It also doesn't help that a lot of DMs are just exceedingly lazy, although they refuse to admit it.

Tell them they would actually have to just merely remove the Animal Empathy or Scry ranks from the prestige class themselves to make it available rather than the book doing the work for them... and they flop on the ground kicking and screaming "I SHOULDN'T HAVE TO DO THE COMPANY'S WORK FOR THEM!!!" :D
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I think that the two examples raised in this thread seem to be relatively straightforward to fix. I don’t think a fine toothed comb is required - just a review.

It seems to me that with any incompatibility with 2014 rules there are three options.

1. Remove or replace the conflicting element (don’t give the extra snake paralysis, don’t use the subclass, use something else from 2024 instead)
2. Use the old rules (use a 2014 snake in that instance, use the 2014 wizard)
3. Amend the rules (give the 2024 snake a saving throw, move the 1st or 2nd level subclass ability to 3rd level)

I think either option is valid. We really shouldn’t portray these issues as irreconcilable problems, even for new DMs. Particularly among friends. If you’re playing with strangers just be upfront about how you’re going to deal with inconsistencies. Heck RPGs aren’t even consistent between products let along between rules revisions. We’ve been doing this stuff for 50 years.
 

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TheSword said:
I think that the two examples raised in this thread seem to be relatively straightforward to fix. I don’t think a fine toothed comb is required - just a review.

It seems to me that with any incompatibility with 2014 rules there are three options.

1. Remove or replace the conflicting element (don’t give the extra snake paralysis, don’t use the subclass, use something else from 2024 instead)
2. Use the old rules (use a 2014 snake in that instance, use the 2014 wizard)
3. Amend the rules (give the 2024 snake a saving throw, move the 1st or 2nd level subclass ability to 3rd level)

I think either option is valid. We really shouldn’t portray these issues as irreconcilable problems, even for new DMs. Particularly among friends. If you’re playing with strangers just be upfront about how you’re going to deal with inconsistencies. Heck RPGs aren’t even consistent between products let along between rules revisions. We’ve been doing this stuff for 50 years.
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Oh, believe me... I see probably 90% of all the complaints given by people here on EN World as nothing more than DMs who are either just desperate for WotC to pat them on the head by insinuating that the rules those DMs want are the right rules and they'll prove it by printing them in the books for everyone else to also have to use... or the DMs who are simply just too lazy to go through any effort of making the game their own and instead want everything handed to them so they don't have to put any additional thought into their game.
 

DEFCON 1 said:
Oh, believe me... I see probably 90% of all the complaints given by people here on EN World as nothing more than DMs who are either just desperate for WotC to pat them on the head by insinuating that the rules those DMs want are the right rules and they'll prove it by printing them in the books for everyone else to also have to use... or the DMs who are simply just too lazy to go through any effort of making the game their own and instead want everything handed to them so they don't have to put any additional thought into their game.
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Or possibly those with a beef about the company/game/system itself that have no intention of buying the product or playing the game and are just looking for something to nitpick.
 

TheSword said:
Or possibly those with a beef about the company/game/system itself that have no intention of buying the the product or playing the game and are just looking for something to nitpick.
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Good point! I forgot about all the players who just show up here to say WotC sucks and that they're glad they aren't spending any money on the game. As though any of the rest of us actually gives a rat's ass whether they are buying D&D product or not, LOL.

It's like those people who call up sports radio stations just to say they refuse to watch Major League Baseball so long as they keep the pitch clock in place. It's like... okay? What, do you want a cookie?
 

DEFCON 1 said:
...I see probably 90% of all the complaints given by people here on EN World as ...
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Mod Note:
.. as something you feel it is okay to insult them about?

It isn't like you don't know that insulting folks isn't okay here. So, cut it out. If you can't handle being civil, it is time for you to disengage from the discussion.
 

DEFCON 1 said:
It also doesn't help that a lot of DMs are just exceedingly lazy, although they refuse to admit it.

Tell them they would actually have to just merely remove the Animal Empathy or Scry ranks from the prestige class themselves to make it available rather than the book doing the work for them... and they flop on the ground kicking and screaming "I SHOULDN'T HAVE TO DO THE COMPANY'S WORK FOR THEM!!!" :D
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I think GMs should disallow/ban more Player options and be even lazier about their games and I'm not kidding.
 

Zardnaar said:

Its The Same Game Right?​

...
Backwards compatible if you squint? Backgrounds are RAW but other stuff is ask your DM I suppose. Thoughts?
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There is no answer that doesn't have a legitimate push-back, and no response that makes even a substantive plurality of people happy. It is a game of considerable likeness to the previous one that has many overlapping features and many components of which line up seamlessly but others do not and adjudication and decision making will be necessary. I don't want to dismiss anyone else's position on the matter, nor does this address anyone's opinions or sense of frustration or aggrievement with the handling of this. However, I think at the 'definitive definition'-level, I just don't think that there is a there there. Like, the concepts of 'the same game' and 'backwards compatible' are not so rigorously defined as to be a singular response.
 

DEFCON 1 said:
It also doesn't help that a lot of DMs are just exceedingly lazy, although they refuse to admit it.

Tell them they would actually have to just merely remove the Animal Empathy or Scry ranks from the prestige class themselves to make it available rather than the book doing the work for them... and they flop on the ground kicking and screaming "I SHOULDN'T HAVE TO DO THE COMPANY'S WORK FOR THEM!!!" :D
Click to expand...
I have literally made and playtested my own systems - don't call me lazy that way. And when I'm making my systems I'm more than happy to do that work. But when I buy a ready made system literally the thing I am paying for is functional rules I don't have to worry about. If I wanted to make the parts myself I'd do it myself (and have); doing this part of the work is literally what I am paying for. And I regard it as a defective product. Is someone who's made kit cars lazy because they return a car that needs assembly and continual fixing?

(I also regard the 3.0/3.5 transition as there having been intentional grit thrown in the compatibility).
 


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