Zardnaar
Legend
Thought I would add some thoughts about this from the DM side of screen. Basically I've been a permanent DM from 1995 (started late 1993) Occasionally I get to play a short campaign when one of my players decides to DM. I'm currently running 3 campaigns for 3 different groups level 2, 7, and 6/7 (C&C old school multiclassing).
In 5E from level 1 or 3 we have made it to level 12-14 a few times current games. 2E we made it to 19th once but usually topped out around level 12/13.
We have played over level 20 in BECMI, 2E and 3E via creating higher level characters. Here's some problems I gave noticed IRL outside the game rues.
1. The amount of time required. Generally it takes a lot of time espicially with older editions. Newer editions assuming a 4 session per level requires close to 80 sessions. Assuming 75% play rate every week it's 2 years to hit level 20. If you play biweekly it's 4 years. Speed running eg 2 sessions per level is still a year.
2. The game year. Not sure how it works overseas but late December and January are basically a wash out. When you're younger it's school holidays then university holidays then summer holidays as an adult. If you're not available odds are your players are afk as well. We get 4 weeks holiday here and 10 or 11 stat days an a lot fall in in those months. If you have some banked up 6-8 week holidays aren't that unusual. Students get more by default (I live in a student city). A 2 or 3 month break can kill campaigns.
3. Dedicated players. In TSR era of D&D we were younger. 6-8 hour sessions were the norm. Now they're 2-4 hours. People you played with you had known since kindergarten in some cases. Or went to school or scouts with. Our high level games we were playing daily in holidays. Start 10am. Hot day go to the river, return keep playing until midnight. One session went 27 hours. That's how we got to level 19 in 2E and it was very Monty haul. More time and bored teenagers.
4. Prep time. Young and stupid you would spend hours prepping for games. I would home brew pantheons, monsters, hand drawn maps. 3E and 4E even harder. 3E try putting a vampire template on a level 7 rogue You have an hour go. 4E drawing maps and designing them was a major pain. I was putting in 3-5 hours work per 4 hour session. It was also like the proverbial frog in boiling water you don't notice until it's to late. You forget how much simpler B/X was until you play it again. Minis can be fun but it's more work, money and time.
5. We play away from home. It's more convenient at home but finding players is a lot harder. They need cars for starters generally. Books are heavy along with battlemats, minis etc. Some poor bastard has to carry that. That poor bastard is me. Student city they tend to live near town or university. They're going to go with what's convenient as well. High level generally requires more books.
These days basically I use a campaign arc then go looking for stuff to adapt for that arc. Example my main game I used Dragon of Stormwrack Isle, then Rise of Runelords pt 1 and Sandpoint, then a mix of Descent into Avernus, Princes of the Apocalypse and Tears for Twilights Hollow (Dungeon 3.0 adventure). I change names and convert/design encounters. My prep time is 20-60 minutes a session.
DM burnout. My longest running campaign has been since December 2023. I've indicated it will be wrapping up soon. I canceled a campaign last year as I wasn't enjoying the social dynamics (2 players were having fun the other 3 were not). The long game has been fun but two players have left town (returning to UK and different provonce), .
The newer players weren't there at campaign start so it feels disjointed and they had no input in what it was about. Eventually I get bored or changing social dynamics of the group end the campaign and we start over. Finishing a WotC campaign eg strahd is start over. By the end of CoS for example everyone was sick of undead and sick of Ravenloft (I didn't DM that one).
Modern D&D (3.0 onwards) just puts more workload on the DM. 3E it was bloat and fears, 4E feats and powers, 5E and 5.5
espicially super hero PCs. More interesting player options is also more work due to power levels and complexity. No way around that.
In 5E from level 1 or 3 we have made it to level 12-14 a few times current games. 2E we made it to 19th once but usually topped out around level 12/13.
We have played over level 20 in BECMI, 2E and 3E via creating higher level characters. Here's some problems I gave noticed IRL outside the game rues.
1. The amount of time required. Generally it takes a lot of time espicially with older editions. Newer editions assuming a 4 session per level requires close to 80 sessions. Assuming 75% play rate every week it's 2 years to hit level 20. If you play biweekly it's 4 years. Speed running eg 2 sessions per level is still a year.
2. The game year. Not sure how it works overseas but late December and January are basically a wash out. When you're younger it's school holidays then university holidays then summer holidays as an adult. If you're not available odds are your players are afk as well. We get 4 weeks holiday here and 10 or 11 stat days an a lot fall in in those months. If you have some banked up 6-8 week holidays aren't that unusual. Students get more by default (I live in a student city). A 2 or 3 month break can kill campaigns.
3. Dedicated players. In TSR era of D&D we were younger. 6-8 hour sessions were the norm. Now they're 2-4 hours. People you played with you had known since kindergarten in some cases. Or went to school or scouts with. Our high level games we were playing daily in holidays. Start 10am. Hot day go to the river, return keep playing until midnight. One session went 27 hours. That's how we got to level 19 in 2E and it was very Monty haul. More time and bored teenagers.
4. Prep time. Young and stupid you would spend hours prepping for games. I would home brew pantheons, monsters, hand drawn maps. 3E and 4E even harder. 3E try putting a vampire template on a level 7 rogue You have an hour go. 4E drawing maps and designing them was a major pain. I was putting in 3-5 hours work per 4 hour session. It was also like the proverbial frog in boiling water you don't notice until it's to late. You forget how much simpler B/X was until you play it again. Minis can be fun but it's more work, money and time.
5. We play away from home. It's more convenient at home but finding players is a lot harder. They need cars for starters generally. Books are heavy along with battlemats, minis etc. Some poor bastard has to carry that. That poor bastard is me. Student city they tend to live near town or university. They're going to go with what's convenient as well. High level generally requires more books.
These days basically I use a campaign arc then go looking for stuff to adapt for that arc. Example my main game I used Dragon of Stormwrack Isle, then Rise of Runelords pt 1 and Sandpoint, then a mix of Descent into Avernus, Princes of the Apocalypse and Tears for Twilights Hollow (Dungeon 3.0 adventure). I change names and convert/design encounters. My prep time is 20-60 minutes a session.
DM burnout. My longest running campaign has been since December 2023. I've indicated it will be wrapping up soon. I canceled a campaign last year as I wasn't enjoying the social dynamics (2 players were having fun the other 3 were not). The long game has been fun but two players have left town (returning to UK and different provonce), .
The newer players weren't there at campaign start so it feels disjointed and they had no input in what it was about. Eventually I get bored or changing social dynamics of the group end the campaign and we start over. Finishing a WotC campaign eg strahd is start over. By the end of CoS for example everyone was sick of undead and sick of Ravenloft (I didn't DM that one).
Modern D&D (3.0 onwards) just puts more workload on the DM. 3E it was bloat and fears, 4E feats and powers, 5E and 5.5
espicially super hero PCs. More interesting player options is also more work due to power levels and complexity. No way around that.
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